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Old 29th March 2003, 21:41
Ecuajey Ecuajey is offline
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Question

What's your opinion(s) on the caseríos of Puerto Rico? Do you think they were necessary during the time they were built, or do you think they were just a quick, unintelligent solution to the housing problem? Do you think they're necessary for this day and age, or should they all be destroyed? What do you think should be done to lower the crime and poverty in these housing projects? Is the militarization of these projects under Rosselló and now Calderón working? If they're destoryed, what do you think should the residents go? You decide!

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Old 30th March 2003, 08:49
Stanley Stanley is offline
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E:

I am older than you----- old enough to remember the arrabales bordering el caño Martin Peña and El Fanguito in Santurce. I remember driving to la parada 18 using the newly built Expreso Las Americas and the 1st thing one would see was the arrabal on the right. I remember how 100% of the population in the arrabal was Popular and how Luis A. Ferre tried in vain to have some of these folks vote for the Partido Estadista Republicano. IN any event, the caserios were built to elimitate the arrabales. They simply moved the folks out and destroyed the arrabal. During those days PR truly looked like a 3rd world country, no doubt about it. EL caserio represents the so called Cultura de la Pobreza in PR and there is another world that perhaps is completely unknown to the middle class. As a young man my dad worked for Asistencia Legal, the equivalent of public attorneys for the poor. He has some war stories to tell about the caserios and arrabales. There was an old saying in PR---- if someone stole a bicycle from your neighborhood you could almost always find it in the nearest caserio.
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Old 31st March 2003, 01:05
Ecuajey Ecuajey is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Stanley
I am older than you
Yes you are, so are most people on this forum. That's why I like to ask you all your opinions on important subjects concerning PR and the world. Thanks for the history, but could you answer some of the contemporary questions? That always stirs debate, which is the basis of this forum.

Do you think they're necessary for this day and age, or should they all be destroyed? What do you think should be done to lower the crime and poverty in these housing projects? Is the militarization of these projects under Rosselló and now Calderón working? If they're destoryed, what do you think should the residents go?
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Old 31st March 2003, 21:17
El_Pastelero El_Pastelero is offline
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Los caserios, para los que no los conocen (los blanquitos de Puerto Rico), son una entidad homogenea. Ellos ven a los que viven en ellos de una manera despectiva, como si tuvieran menos dignidad por ser pobres. Parte de la etica protestante que ve la pobreza como una maldicion y que refleja la asimilacion de cierto sector de la burguesia puertorriquena. Para el burgues que ve de afuera, la gente de los caserios, es una entidad amorfa sin nombre al que hay que exterminar. Inclusive puede que hasta usen jerga sociologica como "la cultura de la pobreza", pero sin saber que signifique ese termino, y que el termino no fue uno peyorativo, sino uno acunado para designar los estragos del capitalismo, que en ningun momento le echaba la culpa a la victima.

Ahora, hay otra forma de mirar a la gente de los caserios; desde adentro. Conociendo las caras (las caras lindas de mi gente negra)de la gente que vive en ellos, sus alegrias y sus pesares para darse cuenta que como decia Bertolt Brecht es mas ladron el que funda un banco que el que lo roba;y muchisimo menos el que roba una bicicleta.

[Edited by El_Pastelero on 1st April 2003 at 04:47]
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Old 31st March 2003, 22:34
LatinoPR LatinoPR is offline
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Ecuajey,

Why do you say that public housing was militarized? If you mean the National Guard was used, then I can understand your assertion that it was “militarized.” I remember when the NG was used to back up the police force, but never was allowed to enter the residential areas. You see, Federal law will not allow them to unless martial law is declared. Many residents were happy to have the police go in and clear out the drug “puntos” and wanted criminals. So much was done, that the puntos run by many moved to la isla. Many residencia publicas became more safer to live, not completely, but safer than before. In reference to do we need them? It is hard to say. In an island that is overpopulated and land is hard to come by, it is hard to say. But let me say this, I have been to Mexico and have seen that the poor have nothing unless you are a “ejidatario.” They are people who live in areas for many generations and are able to get land for free, as long as they develop it. Our poor in Puerto Rico can live in public housing or request a parcela, either way, they are better off then a lot of folks in the world.
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Old 1st April 2003, 11:10
Stanley Stanley is offline
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Pastelero:

Yautia? Is that you? The words sound familiar!

Well, I still think there is such a thing as "Cultura de la Pobreza". As I said; my dad was at one time an attorney working for Asistencia Legal and he saw some things which are very hard to believe. This things are certainly foreign to those in the middle class. The latter is simply an observation and does not negate the fact that there are many highly moral persons in The Caserio who are great persons. I have known many from the Caserios that were better than many in the upper classes. But, there is also some scum in the Caserios----- there is no need to make everybody a saint.

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Old 1st April 2003, 20:20
Ecuajey Ecuajey is offline
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Question

Quote:
Originally posted by LatinoPR
Our poor in Puerto Rico can live in public housing or request a parcela, either way, they are better off then a lot of folks in the world.
Good points. Speaking with some people on this forum and others in PR, most had bad views about caseríos and the people who reside there. Speaking to my aunt, (El_Pastelero, mi tía no es una blanquita, pero una trigueña bella. Pues, los negros y trigueños no son la única gente que los conoce. También, hay blanquitos que viven en los caseríos. Sé que la mayoría son de gente "de color," pero la cantante, Gisselle, creció en el caserío de Juncos y conoció a unos de mis primos...aunque no quiere admitirlo y dice, en lugar, que es de San Juan, jajaja.) her opinions of the caseríos were that most of the people there don't belong there; that most of them have satellite TV and cars...etc My visitation of the caserío in Juncos, (My aunt also promised me that she'll give me a tour of Luis Lloréns Torres, lol) was that it was run-down place full of heroine addicts and people who just like to hang out. My grandmother's friend, who was one of the first residents of Nemesio Canales in Hato Rey, told me he was happy that they were tearing it down, because the people there have turned it into a hell-hole.

So, what I'm trying to say is, did that militirization really solve their problems? According to you, they changed things a little for the better, but is that all that should be done and who's to say that those places won't become major drug-centers in a few years? Also, are the people there really "poor" to what you see fits the definition? If so, what else should be done to reduce their poverty instead of just placing them in housing projects and letting them grow up to be drug-addicts, prostitutes, drug-dealers, wannabe gangsters...etc (I realize there have been people who have done well with their lives who lived in caseríos.)
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