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  • El_Jibaro...

    I was just wondering what type of Christian you are. (ie-Lutheran, Roman Catholic, Anglican...)


  • #2
    Pentecostal, mijo, Pentecostal!

    [i]We believe that JESUS still Baptizes Christians today into the HOLY SPIRIT, with Speaking in Other Tongues as the VISIBLE EVIDENCE of that event .

    Perhaps you need to learn the DIFFERENCE between the THREE BAPTISMS that Christians in the New Testament had:

    BAPTISM from the Greek word BAPTIZO, literally means SUBMERGED BATH.

    ******************* 1 *******************

    BAPTISM INTO CHRIST - The HOLY SPIRIT takes a person who repents and believes wholeheartedly in JESUS and plucks him/her out of the camp of those doomed to destruction and COMPLETELY SUBMERGES that person into the BODY OF JESUS CHRIST. That person now belongs to JESUS. If that person dies at that instant, he/she goes instantly to Heaven to be with JESUS.

    This EVENT is a spiritual event, seen only by God Himself and spiritual beings
    (angels and fallen angels).

    ******************* 2 *******************

    WATER BAPTISM - Now, that person who has repented of his/her sins and believes that Jesus rose LITERALLY from death
    (that is, that he rose from death in REAL PHYSICAL FORM, not as a ghost or as a mirage) and who personally proclaims openly that Jesus is LORD in every way (including turning his/her life over in surrender totally to HIM), after meeting these requirements is taken to a pool, or river, or large body of water, and is COMPLETELY SUBMERGED into those waters by a Christian Leader in the NAME of the FATHER-SON-HOLYSPIRIT.

    This EVENT is a physical event seen by human beings
    (Christians and Non-Christians), and it is done to proclaim to the world that this person is now a Christian, that he/she now belongs to Christ.

    ******************* 3 *******************

    BAPTISM INTO the HOLY SPIRIT - Now JESUS takes that person who is a Christian and EMPOWERS him/her for service by COMPLETELY SUBMERGING him/her in the HOLY SPIRIT.

    The rationale for this is that in this present spiritually dark world where Satan rules it is ESSENTIAL that the Christian has POWER to be a living witness of JESUS and HIS MESSAGE. That is why just before going to Heaven
    (flying off to Heaven right in front of 500 eyewitnesses ), JESUS told the Apostles to stay in Jerusalem until they were FILLED UP WITH POWER. Ten days later JESUS DROWNED THESE APOSTLES WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT, and they began speaking in OTHER TONGUES. The people there when that happened and who had no place for JESUS in their hearts labeled the Apostles as "DRUNKS". But those persons, who had room in their hearts for JESUS to enter, heard the Apostles PRAISE God in their particular country language.

    This EVENT is both a spiritual event as well as physical event seen by human beings
    (Christians and Non-Christians)[b], who can see the Christian PRAISING JESUS in a Heavenly Language. As a physical event, Non-Christians may be alarmed and think that the Christian is either DRUNK or going crazy (1 Corinthians 14:23), but other Christians will not. As a spiritual event, the Christian is now equipped to fight against the spiritual beings now ruling this present spiritually dark world (2 Corinthians 10:4).

    Comment


    • #3
      That's not what I was asking.
      I was wondering what type of Christian you were.
      Thanks
      And btw, I know about the three types of Baptism.

      Comment


      • #4
        I gave you my answer, but you did not read it, did you?

        [b][i]PENTECOSTAL.

        I couldn't be any clearer.

        Perhaps you don't know the difference between a Presbyterian and a PENTECOSTAL...

        Comment


        • #5
          Sorry, you are right, I didn't read it carefully.
          What does "mijo" mean?

          Are all version of the Bible the same?
          If not, then why?
          Do the different types of Christians use different versions of the Bible?

          Comment


          • #6
            mijo, pronounced MEE-HO in Spanish, is a shortened

            [i]version of "mi hijo", which means "my son". Basically I told you "sonny".

            First of all, the Greek word BIBLIA means "BOOKS" in plural.

            Are all versions of the Bible the same?

            Basically YES , with the exception of the Jehovah Witnesses "bible", which was made in some dark closet in the middle of nowhere (or perhaps was made in the "Twilight Zone"); you can check this out by trying to find out the names of the "translators" for the JW "bible" - YOU WILL NOT FIND ANY NAMES...

            There is a sizeable number of XENOPHOBIC religious zealots out there that swear that the King James Version is SACRED, even more so than the most ancient manuscripts of the Bible in their original Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic scrolls. That is HOGWASH (particularly in view of that kind of outlandish claim making any other language outside Sheakspearean English unsacred... I LOVE ESPAŅOL ). The same was said of the VULGATA Bible in Latin back in the days of the Reformation, and that is almost forgotten history now .

            There are TWO TECHNICAL issues on translations that you may want to be aware of:

            ISSUE NUMBER 1

            There is a DIFFERENCE between Catholic-Orthodox-Protestant Bibles in that a few books in the OLD TESTAMENT are deemed sacred by Catholics and Orthodox churches, while most Protestant churches do not agree. The "split" was there even before there were any Protestants, since St. Jerome himself, the guy who made the Latin VULGATA Bible, discovered that there were some books in the Old Testament that JEWS considered not sacred.
            (By the way, it was St. Paul who said that the OLD TESTAMENT was the Patrimony of the JEWS, thus at least JUDAISM has determined CORRECTLY which books in the OLD TESTAMENT are really sacred.) Thus, St. Jerome placed these "sacred books" of doubtful or UNKNOWN inspiration between the OLD TESTAMENT and the NEW TESTAMENT. All the sacred writings of KNOWN inspiration (that is, there was no doubt that they were INSPIRED BY GOD), were called CANNONICAL, that is they are REGULATION stuff. All the "other books" were not declared "sacred" until Protestants came into history, done by the Catholic clergy to SPITE the fellow SEPARATED Christians, and they were labeled DEUTEROCANNONICAL, that is of the "Second Cannon", or Second Rule. Happily, the portions in "dispute" only number about 9 EXTRA scrolls out of the entire OLD TESTAMENT for the Catholic Cannon, and a couple more added to those Extra 9 for the Orthodox Cannon.

            Thus, a Catholic Bible has ALL THE BOOKS a Protestant Bible has, plus 9 more in the OLD TESTAMENT. However, ALL CHRISTIAN CHURCHES HAVE THE SAME 27 BOOKS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT.

            None of the EXTRA books have any particular teachings that contradict CHRISTIAN teachings, except for a tiny passage in 2 Maccabees where idolatrous Jews who die in war receive prayers AFTER THEY DIE for the forgiveness of their idolatries..., but that is not supported in the rest of the Bible by neither the OLD or NEW Testaments.

            ISSUE NUMBER 2

            I hope you know that the New Testament was entirely written in Greek, otherwise the rest of this part is going to impossible for you to understand.

            For the first 1500 years, the New Testament was copied by hand
            (for first 3000 years the Old Testament was copied by hand). This is a Historical FACT. Not until the invention of the Printing Press do things change.

            So, in all those hand copies errors may have crept in. How do we determine the copying errors? Well, we take all the available hand copies of the New Testament and compare them. There are around 24,000 ancient hand copies still in existence. Wonderfully, after all the comparison is made, only 2% of the text varies; and this is REMARKABLE, since those were many centuries of manual labor, of men toiling at hand copying from the Roman Sewers in the earlier years to dark Medieval castle rooms with only scant light. NONE OF THOSE variations deny any and all of the CHRISTIAN TEACHINGS !

            Now, the matter on ISSUE 2 is that several translations in the last 500 years have relied on the least reliable of the old Greek manuscripts. This happens to be the case in the King James Version, where the Sheakespearean translators relied on the "Textus Receptus" Greek New Testament manuscripts, a manuscript "made up" by Erasmus of Rotterdam. Erasmus tried his best to get into his hands the oldest Greek New Testament Manuscript available in his times, but at least ofr the last chapters of the New Testament, he had to literally make them up from the Latin VULGATA Bible.

            However, that "Textus Receptus" is not a problem for many new translations like the "NIV", the "New Living Translation", the "Good News" Bible, etc., etc. You can check these translations out at the link: http://bible.gospelcom.net/ . All these Bibles rely on a "CRITICAL TEXT" of the New Testament. In other words, scholars have done their best to reconstruct the New Testament to its original wording and they have called this Greek New Testament the "CRITICAL TEXT". History may yet prove out that the new "CRITICAL TEXT" is as close to the Original books written by the Apostles as the "Textus Receptus", but it is the best thing out there yet.

            Some modern scholars are debating that the most reliable Greek New Testament Manuscript is what the Greek Orthodox Church uses: the BYZANTINE TEXT. But this is a recent development in Greek New Testament scholarship. However, this BYZANTINE TEXT resembles alot to the "Textus Receptus". No modern Bible translation in the last 500 years has been made based on the BYZANTINE TEXT.

            BOTTOM LINE:

            Buy yourself a "Good News" Bible
            (of which they have an edition for Catholics), or better yet a "New Living Translation" or an "NIV" (which means New International Version)[b]. You can get whatever Bible version you want, and it will not be any more different, the only reason why I am recommending you these is that they are easier to understand in modern English.

            BUT STAY AWAY FROM THE "bible" MADE BY "UN-NAMED" TRANSLATORS..., that kind of crap is not read by any SERIOUS Bible student, only by fanatics with blinders on.

            Well, have a good and blessed weekend !

            Comment


            • #7
              I have the two different versions of the Bible that you mentioned. I'm Roman Catholic but I've never heard of Maccabees. In what version of the Bible is that in? I've been reading the New Living Translation version.

              Also, I was wondering what you think about capital punishment. Do you think it is wrong?

              Hope to hear from you soon! Take care!

              Rachel

              Comment


              • #8
                The best Catholic Bible Translation is the "New Jerusalem Bible".

                [i]You can buy a paperback edition of the "New Jerusalem Bible" in the American Bible Society ( https://abstore.americanbible.org/abs1/ ) for only $7.00 dollars (the regular price of any paperback book). There you will find the extra books in the Old Testament that the Catholic Church consider sacred, among them 1st and 2nd Maccabees.

                However, the "New Jerusalem Bible" is a little too technical in its use of the English Language. A great Catholic version of the Bible which is very similar to the New Living Translation in its clear modern English usage is the "Today's English Version -- Good News Bible" with Catholic "IMPRIMATUR"
                (Catalog #00104892 in the same American Bible Society bookstore above, and only costs $10.00 dollars).

                ================================================

                About the DEATH PENALTY, let me say a few things. Today the Pope says it is wrong, but that goes against Catholic Doctrine of the previous 15 centuries. Not until the early part of the 20th Century did the Catholic Church change its mind on Capital Punishment.

                Why does the Pope say it is wrong?

                I think that the Pope appeals to GOD as the only being with authority to put anyone to death. In this case my opinion is "OF COURSE ONLY GOD HAS THE AUTHORITY TO COMDEMN CRIMINALS TO DEATH".

                Now I ask: "what did GOD say about Capital Punishment?"

                Genesis 9:5,6
                And murder is forbidden. Animals that kill people must die, and any person who murders must be killed. Yes, you must execute anyone who murders another person, for to kill a person is to kill a living being made in GOD'S IMAGE.


                According to the above statement made by GOD HIMSELF, HE has commanded humans to EXECUTE murderers, even animals that commit homicide. Being that animals are irrational, a logical conclusion is that even insane humans who commit murder
                (like the Texas lady who killed her five children) should be executed.

                Now, I have to be honest with you: in this corrupt world we are living in, JUSTICE is not carried out JUSTLY 100% of the time
                (maybe not even 60% of the time...). Thus, in our world, the rich and famous are most of the time spared from getting their rightly deserved punishment when they commit a crime. However, when GOD commanded Capital Punishment HE knew that humans are not fair and just. GOD gave a perfect command that should be carried out in the most justly way, and by logic if it is carried out UNJUSTLY (that is, some murderers are spared punishment because of their influence while even some innocent people get executed for crimes they did not commit) then those who have carried out GOD's command in an UNJUST manner will have to answer to HIM.

                Which brings me to this last point: Capital Punishment is not the ULTIMATE kind of punishment. If, like some cults teach, human beings did not have an eternal soul, then Capital Punishment would be indeed the ULTIMATE kind of punishment, but since we DO have an eternal soul Capital Punishment is NOT the ULTIMATE kind of punishment.

                JESUS HIMSELF said it this way:
                Matthew 10:28
                "Don't be afraid of those who want to kill you. They can only kill your body; they cannot touch your soul. Fear only God, who can destroy both soul and body in hell.


                So, if anyone executes an innocent person UNJUSTLY then the executors (from the judge down to the prosecutor, to the jury, to the warden who pulls the lever...) will have to give an account before GOD and run the risk of being comdemned to hell for doing this INJUSTICE. While the innocent person who dies may end up in Heaven
                (if he/she believes wholeheartedly in JESUS CHRIST and repented from his/her sins)[b].

                Now, how about Puerto Rico, where there is no Capital Punishment?

                Well, to condemn a murderer to a Life Sentence may indeed fulfill ALMOST the Capital Punishment GOD has commanded humans to carry out. If the murderer spends the rest of his/her time on earth without harming anyone, and later believes wholeheartedly in JESUS CHRIST and changes from his/her ways, then it is a good thing. But in PRACTICALITY the lack of Capital Punishment in Puerto Rico does contribute to the moral climate of LAWLESSNESS in Puerto Rico. One chief reason for GOD to place Capital Punishment as a rule for humanity is that even though HE can afford to wait 80 years to deal with a murderer, humanity cannot afford it. If murderers are let loose, not only will they murder other human beings again, but most other human beings will become violent too, since there will be no restraint: it is coming to the "Law of the Jungle", where only the strong and evil will survive; society will inevitably become a "Wild West"...

                Comment


                • #9
                  If a criminal was sentenced to death than wouldn't the person that that killed the criminal also be disobeying the commandment "Thou shall not kill."?

                  Also, didn't Jesus say in the New Testement "You have heard that the law of Moses says, 'If an eye is injured, injure the eye of the person that did it. If a tooth gets knocked out, knock out the tooth of the person who did it'. But I say, don't resist an evil person! If you are slapped on the right cheek, turn the other too."
                  - Matthew 6:38-39

                  In the Old Testement, didn't it say "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth."? Are we supposed to follow the New CovTake care, and thanks for your help[. enant with Jesus, or the Old Covenant with Moses?

                  One more thing. God has a plan for everything. Does that mean that everything that happens is a part of His Plan, or do some things happen because humans do things, such as murder? Do people get sicknesses and have accidents as a part of His Plan?



                  Rachel

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Things they don't teach you in catechism...

                    First of all, the 10 COMMANDMENTS are the first part of a CONSTITUTION.

                    Just like our U.S. Constitution, which has a First Article and a First Ammendment, the NATION of Israel had a CONSTITUTION written by GOD Himself.

                    If you remember your catechism, Israel was not liberated from Slavery in Egypt by Moses, or a political party, but by GOD Himself .

                    So, just after LIBERATION from Egypt, God called Moses up to the mountain top and gave him the First Article of the CONSTITUTION of Israel: the 10 COMMANDMENTS. Added to these 10 COMMANDMENTS were another 590-plus Commandments dealing with everything required from them, from DIETARY LAWS to Hygiene.

                    The 10 COMMANDMENTS are not UNIVERSAL by any stretch of the imagination. It is part of a CONTRACT between GOD and a particular Nation. If that particular Nation complies with the CONTRACT then they get a secured PIECE of land and material benefits in return. If they don't comply then they get kicked out of the land and GOD breaks the CONTRACT. Read carefully the Bible, and compare it to history and you will find out that Israel did not fulfill its part in the deal and have been kicked out of the land a couple of times to say the least. The last "KICK OUT" lasted from AD-70 to AD-1948.

                    Go check out the 10 COMMANDMENTS themselves, you will not find in them any promise of HEAVEN, and if you check out the 4th one you will see how local this CONTRACT is: the one about the SABBATH. If you happen to live in the North Pole you could never apply it well since it is NIGHTIME there 3 months out of the year. And the OBSERVANCE of the SABBATH is strictly regulated by the EVENING-MORNING rule, that is, the Sabbath begins on a Friday at SUN-DOWN, and ends on a Saturday at SUN-DOWN. Try to figure that in a place where there is UNCEASING NIGHT for 3 months out of the Year...

                    Anyway, lets look at the 10 COMMANDMENTS:


                    Exodus 20:1-21
                    1Then God instructed the people as follows:

                    2"I am the LORD your God, who rescued you from slavery in Egypt.

                    (1) 3"Do not worship any other gods besides me.

                    (2) 4"Do not make idols of any kind, whether in the shape of birds or animals or fish. 5You must never worship or bow down to them, for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God who will not share your affection with any other god! I do not leave unpunished the sins of those who hate me, but I punish the children for the sins of their parents to the third and fourth generations. 6But I lavish my love on those who love me and obey my commands, even for a thousand generations.

                    (3) 7"Do not misuse the name of the LORD your God. The LORD will not let you go unpunished if you misuse his name.

                    (4) 8"Remember to observe the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9Six days a week are set apart for your daily duties and regular work, 10but the seventh day is a day of rest dedicated to the LORD your God. On that day no one in your household may do any kind of work. This includes you, your sons and daughters, your male and female servants, your livestock, and any foreigners living among you. 11For in six days the LORD made the heavens, the earth, the sea, and everything in them; then he rested on the seventh day. That is why the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy.

                    (5) 12"Honor your father and mother. Then you will live a long, full life in the land the LORD your God will give you.

                    (6) 13"Do not murder.

                    (7) 14"Do not commit adultery.

                    (8) 15"Do not steal.

                    (9) 16"Do not testify falsely against your neighbor.

                    (10) 17"Do not covet your neighbor's house. Do not covet your neighbor's wife, male or female servant, ox or donkey, or anything else your neighbor owns."

                    18When the people heard the thunder and the loud blast of the horn, and when they saw the lightning and the smoke billowing from the mountain, they stood at a distance, trembling with fear.

                    19And they said to Moses, "You tell us what God says, and we will listen. But don't let God speak directly to us. If he does, we will die!"

                    20"Don't be afraid," Moses said, "for God has come in this way to show you his awesome power. From now on, let your fear of him keep you from sinning!"

                    21As the people stood in the distance, Moses entered into the deep darkness where God was.
                    Now, in your own time, go check out the rest of the TORAH, from Exodus 20:22 to Deuteronomy 34:10, where you will find the rest of the 600 plus COMMANDMENTS that Israel has to OBEY, and you will discover that CAPITAL PUNISHMENT was part and parcel of the Israel Constitution written by GOD HIMSELF.

                    Now, when JESUS came 1500 years later and spoke the "Sermon on the Mount", of which you wrote an excerpt, HE made EXPLICIT what was IMPLICIT in the Israel CONTRACT. By this time (when JESUS began preaching), Jewish THEOLOGIANS had so stressed the EXTERNAL AND VISUAL features of the Israel CONTRACT that it almost did not matter what people had in their HEARTS when they obeyed those laws as long as they complied with them EXTERNALLY. In that way, many Jews got away "with murder" while EXTERNALLY smelling like roses...

                    And this last thought brings us to the following point: the CONTRACT that GOD made with Israel had the single PURPOSE to make ALL ISRAELITES aware that they were ALL LAWBREAKERS. Only ONE PERSON in the entire Universe could comply fully with the 600-plus laws in the "GOD vs Israel CONTRACT": JESUS HIMSELF
                    (who gave them the 600-plus laws to begin with...) Now, if the CHOSEN NATION, the People of Israel, could not obey fully all the 600-plus laws in the "GOD vs Israel CONTRACT", imagine how even less all of us PORK-EATERS will ever fulfill that CONTRACT (hey, we who are not Jews were not even included in the original CONTRACT to begin with...) That ONE PERSON in the entire Universe who could comply fully with the 600-plus laws not only fully complied, but HE died on a Roman cross so that through FAITH IN HIM all Jews could be PARDONED for not OBSERVING FULLY all the stipulations of the CONTRACT. And because the ONE PERSON in the entire Universe who could comply fully with the 600-plus laws happens to be GOD HIMSELF, not only are Jews PARDONED, but everyone else in the world who happens to BELIEVE WHOLEHEARTEDLY IN HIM (John 3:16).

                    Do you believe wholeheartedly in JESUS?

                    If not, you still have time TODAY .

                    ===============================

                    On the "ISSUE OF SUFFERING", it is not a short issue, but let me say this: when Adam and Eve walked in the GARDEN the world was TOTALLY DIFFERENT. Because they broke their own CONTRACT with GOD
                    (pay attention, this doesn't happen to be the same CONTRACT mentioned before...), GOD had to let them and US see ALL the CONSEQUENCES of breaking the CONTRACT. All the BAD THINGS happening we ourselves caused. To RESCUE the Universe from all the evil we ourselves have caused, GOD put into place a RESCUE PLAN, which included GOD HIMSELF taking up the GUILT and PUNISHMENT deserved by Adam, Eve and the rest of us. The time WILL COME when the entire Universe will be remade brand new, but this time with NONE of the evils of the present Universe.

                    So, lets take the "example" of MURDER. A human being with a FREE WILL decides to kill another innocent human being
                    (lets assume we are talking about a serial killer pedophile killing a 5 year old boy). GOD did not PLAN for a human being with a FREE WILL to kill the innocent boy, that EVIL PLAN was concocted by the human being with a FREE WILL. Now, out of that MURDER in itself GOD can use to RESCUE the people involved: - A - the child instantly goes to HEAVEN (nowhere in the Bible is it taught that innocent children are guilty of sin and therefore deserve either hell or a limbo), - B - the Perpetrator will have one more chance to REPENT, or if he doesn't he will have to answer to GOD for one more CRIME, - C - the parents of the child will either get closer to GOD or whatever was inside their HEARTS will make them to withdraw away from GOD (sometimes "good and happy" people only do good because everything is going their fine and dandy way...). Many times, "good and happy" people discover their need of GOD when they encounter real suffering, it happens to be the case for most of us. Find yourself someone who seeks GOD with all their strength when everything is going good for them (when they have plenty of health, fame and fortune)[b], you will find only a few.

                    Well, I ran out of lunch time. Have a good day.

                    [Edited by El_Jibaro on 21st August 2001 at 20:23]

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Since God controls everything and has a plan for the universe, than wouldn't murders and killing be a part of it. For all we know, God could have put murderers on Earth for a reason.. Maybe the victim's family was losing faith in God and that was what they needed to restore their faith. The way I see it, I tell myself that even though bad things happen, it's all a part of His Plan.

                      OR... If you look at it from a different point of view, you could say that God created humans to have a free will. They (humans themselves) choose to commit crimes. We are given the gift of free will and sometimes we make the wrong choices. There are many different ways you can look at the topic, and I guess it's up to you to believe what you want. We won't know what He intended until we die.

                      About your question on whether I whole heartedly believe in Christ. YES. I do. I admit, there may have been times when my faith waivered, but I learned from it. I am happy to say that I trust Him in all I do (at least I try my best to). Now, can I ask YOU the same question. Do YOU believe in Christ with all your heart and soul?

                      Well, I better get going now. Take care.

                      Your CANADIAN friend,
                      Rachel




                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The Bible doesn't say that God controls EVERYTHING...

                        JESUS only said that GOD knows about EVERYTHING going on, not that he controls all of it...

                        This is what JESUS said and how Matthew his disciple heard it said:

                        Matthew 10:28,29

                        28"Don't be afraid of those who want to kill you. They can only kill your body; they cannot touch your soul. Fear only God, who can destroy both soul and body in hell. 29NOT EVEN A SPARROW, WORTH ONLY HALF A PENNY, CAN FALL TO THE GROUND WITHOUT YOUR FATHER KNOWING IT. 31So don't be afraid; you are more valuable to him than a whole flock of sparrows.


                        Paul's assistant, Dr. Luke, inquired 20 years later from other eyewitnesses on the same teaching and recorded for history the words they heard:

                        Luke 12:4-7

                        4"Dear friends, don't be afraid of those who want to kill you. They can only kill the body; they cannot do any more to you. 5But I'll tell you whom to fear. Fear God, who has the power to kill people and then throw them into hell.

                        6"What is the price of five sparrows? A couple of pennies? YET GOD DOES NOT FORGET A SINGLE ONE OF THEM. 7And the very hairs on your head are all numbered. So don't be afraid; you are more valuable to him than a whole flock of sparrows.


                        Notice that it is never mentioned there that GOD controls every event, only that GOD is fully aware of every event.

                        Now, Rachel, the big CONCEPT here is that "modern science" spouts every single minute everywhere that human beings are mere ANIMALS, that "Nature is all there is...". According to this CONCEPT human beings are only irrational automatons driven by all sorts of desires and choices inbred into them and coproduced by environmental forces beyond their control. If this were the case, then the TRUTH would not even exist, since merely trying to KNOW the TRUTH on our part would be at the same plane of validity as a cow belching in a pasture land down in Idaho.

                        What the BIBLE documents is that human beings are totally different to animals, in that even though human beings share the same matter and physiological design as animals do, human beings have an IMMORTAL spirit breathed into them by GOD. That is why, even though human beings have a brain the same size and shape of a dolphin's, you never see dolphins debating the MEANING OF LIFE, you never see them aspiring to ETERNAL EXISTENCE and PERPETUAL GLORY. In fact, elephants have brains with the same shape as ours but are two to three times LARGER than ours, and you never see them trying to figure if there is a planet like ours in outer space... You don't see a humongous herd of elephants trying to make a "Pyramid" of as much as possible perfect geometry to last for thousands of years... You don't see elephants, nor dolphins, nor whales writing poetry to last 'til the end of time... I personally remember being three years old and thinking "Why am I unique? Why am I not someone else?" Now, it goes to show that a creature not even 40 pounds in weight can ponder things that creatures weighing TONS do not care about. And what is the DIFFERENCE?

                        THE INVISIBLE SPARK OF "ETERNITY" WITHIN US.

                        The same SPARK that fuels the fire in our hearts for ETERNAL MEANING; not only do we want to live forever, but we want to live forever in COMPLETENESS.

                        This SPARK makes us UNIQUE. I cannot share your inner existence with you, even if I were right by your side.

                        That same SPARK not only makes us UNIQUE, but drives our FREE WILL, so that even though you may be tortured in a Communist Re-education Camp in the middle of a jungle in Colombia, even though with your bruised lips you may say that you "agree" with what the Communist "Educator" is trying to force down your throat, in your inner being you LOATHE that crooked ideal with fiery passion.

                        Yet in some human beings, that SPARK that makes them UNIQUE is used by these individuals to create the most heinous forms of evil imaginable (for it is beyond doubt that there are hundreds of "Hannibals" out there doing their fiendish deeds...). And, according to the BIBLE, all of us human beings have used our SPARK to do some form of evil, even if it is not as outlandish as cannibalizing somebody.

                        Anyway, as long as the "Nature is all there is..." CONCEPT dominates our thoughts we cannot imagine GOD to be something other than an "arbitrary tyrant", and even TRUTH itself will be as foreign to us as air is to fish with only gills...

                        =================================================

                        About having JESUS I must remind you that it is not merely a mental idea of HIM. JESUS once asked HIS disciples:
                        Matthew 16:13-16

                        13When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, "Who do people say that the Son of Man is?"

                        14"Well," they replied, "some say John the Baptist, some say Elijah, and others say Jeremiah or one of the other prophets."

                        15Then he asked them, "Who do you say I am?"

                        16Simon Peter answered, "You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God."


                        MESSIAH is no simple title: it means KING OF THE UNIVERSE. Therefore, to acknowledge truly JESUS as the MESSIAH one must surrender totally to His dominion.

                        SON OF GOD meant in the ears of the Jewish listeners back then in 30AD to be GOD HIMSELF, since to be truly a son, the person being the son must have THE SAME QUALITIES of the father (back then they did not know that mothers gave half of their chromosomes to their offspring...). And there are three characteristics that set GOD apart from all of HIS creatures:

                        1- HE IS EVERYWHERE

                        2- HE KNOWS EVERYTHING

                        3- HE CAN DO EVERYTHING (except to LIE)

                        Thus for the person who professes that JESUS is the SON OF GOD, that person must believe wholeheartedly that JESUS is GOD.

                        [b]I, like Peter say wholeheartedly here in this forum that JESUS IS the Messiah, the Son of the living God !!![i]

                        I hope you do too .

                        [Edited by El_Jibaro on 22nd August 2001 at 22:15]

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                        • #13
                          Just because the Bible doesn't say that God controls everything, doesn't mean he doesn't or can't. True, he may not, but on the other side of things, the Bible also does not state that He DOESN'T control everything. Like I said, these questions will be answered in the right time.

                          One time, my classmate asked a question that no one could find the answer to. "Why did God put us on the Earth to begin with"? For me, I think that it is a kind of test to prove our faith.

                          What is your opinion on the topic?

                          Well, I better get going. It's time for dinner and my mom is calling. Enjoy the rest of your summer! It's coming to an end more quickly than I wanted=)

                          Lastly, I was wondering what are your thoughts on any type of birth control. Is it wrong?

                          Rachel

                          "For I can do everything with the Christ who gives me the strength I need."
                          -Philippians 4:13



                          [Edited by r_so on 23rd August 2001 at 20:16]

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                          • #14
                            Actually, if everything were under God's total perfect control there...

                            [b][i]would be no enemies of God for that matter.

                            Right now there is a "STAR WARS" of sorts going on, and we are right there in the FRONTLINE.

                            It isn't fought with weapons bound to time-space, it is fought with weapons that trascend time-space: PRAYER, FAITH, TRUTH, RIGHTEOUSNESS, SALVATION, and the WORD of GOD.

                            When the WAR is over then will everything be MADE BRAND NEW AGAIN that will be under TOTAL PERFECT CONTROL of GOD.

                            --------------------------------

                            About birth control, when you are just about to get married discuss that with your future husband. That is between you two and God.

                            My two cents: try to have as many children as you can, since there are MANY OF US WHO CAN'T. Children are truly a blessing, never a pain, or a burden.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I've heard from some people that it says in the Bible that any form of birth control isn't good. It says that you're sex is only supposed to be for giving birth to children and not for pleasure.

                              Others say that God allows it or else He wouldn't have given humans that type of feeling.

                              I was just curious about the topic.

                              Rachel

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