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Por qué independencia? y Por qué estadidad?

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  • Por qué independencia? y Por qué estadidad?

    Por qué piensas que Puerto Rico debe ser estado ó independiente?
    Beneficios y desventajas

  • #2
    Aquí volvemos a lo mismo.

    En Puerto Rico la gente cree, digo, ESTÁN 500% CONVENCIDOS, que lo del status es un asunto como escoger una candidata al concurso de Miss Universo.

    Me imagino algunos en Puerto Rico discutiendo:

    Oye Puruca, ¿Quien te gusta más, la candidata de Polonia o la del Brasil?

    Oye Gamalier, ¿no crees que la candidata de Argentina tiene mejores curvas, pero la de Venezuela se ve mejor en bikini?

    Lo que pasa es que en una cultura política dónde el mismo Governador accede a una entrevista con LA COMAY, que más se puede esperar. Nos tienen convencidos que lo único que hay que hacer es votar por el status que mas nos guste y FUÁCATA, nos dan lo que sea por que asi funciona la democracia.

    Lo que los puertorriqueños nos debemos preguntar es, ¿Como cae Puerto Rico en los mejores intereses nacionales de Estados Unidos. ¿Le servimos de algo? ¿Que ganan ELLOS con darnos la estadidad?

    ¿Nos aceptan como estado si vamos a tener mas poder político que 27 estados, muchos de los cuales han estado en la unión desde el 1776?

    ¿Nos aceptarán hablando español?

    ¿Nos aceptan como estado en un momento cuando hay una paranoia rampante en los Estados Unidos que los hispanos no quieren aprender inglés?

    ¿Nos aceptan como estado cuando el movimiento "TEA PARTY" está listo a coger las armas para evitar que se extiendan los ENTITLEMENTS?

    ¿Entitlements? Significa, TRANSFERENCIAS FEDERALES, que es lo mismo que MANTENGO Y CUPONES!

    ¿Nos aceptan como estado siendo el estado más pobre, donde el 75% vivirá del mantengo y cupones?

    Lo que debemos preguntarnos en la isla es como nos darán la independencia sin la mayoría quererla.

    Si eso lo han hecho otras naciones que han tenido colonias con cuidadanía, ¿que hace de los Estados Unidos diferente?

    Comment


    • #3
      El mejor estatus

      De acuerdo con clip; la soluciones para los Boricuas en Puerto Rico y aca en los estados, tienen que ver mas con esfuerzos personales que en la cuestion de estatus. Hemos gastado casi un siglo argumentando sobre ese tema mientras estan llegando miles de extranjeros a la isla y aca en los estados para utilsar las ventajas que existen para mejorar sus vidas economicas y conseguir trabajos que los boricuas deben ocupar. Vivo muy cera a una communidad India-Asiatica y cuando utiliso el tren me doy cuenta que la majoridad en el tren son indios educados que caminan rumbo a New York y Newark a sus trabajos tecnicos de camisa blanca. Me pregunto, DONDE ESTAN LOS BORICUAS? Que tristeza me da ante de este escenario.

      Comment


      • #4
        Sonanbulo los boricuas estan en sus apartamentos, cogiendo welfare, cupones , plan 8, SSI y hasta la madre de los tomates......jejejejejeje Salen de Puerto Rico y en vez de progresar, prefieren el mantengo.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by MimaPr View Post
          Sonanbulo los boricuas estan en sus apartamentos, cogiendo welfare, cupones , plan 8, SSI y hasta la madre de los tomates......jejejejejeje Salen de Puerto Rico y en vez de progresar, prefieren el mantengo.
          Y quien les da el mantengo?

          Y por que les da el mantengo?

          Hay una logica al mantengo. Y esa logica no es de los buena gentes que me gusta regalarle los chavos de gratis a la gente porque me gusta....

          Existe el mantengo porque esta sirviendo un proposito especifico.

          Comment


          • #6
            el problema

            El problema viene sobre el abuso de ese mantengo y el efecto perpetuo que la pega a la gente porque el mantengo disminuye el incentivo y deseo de superar. No le tiro al que esta abajo y quiero que sepan que cuando era joven el viejo borachon y abusivo que era mi padre nos abandono, mi mama tuvo que buscar ayuda public. Despues de unos anos se busco un trabajo y, al tiempo, no tuvimos que vivir con la ayuda del gobierno. Sin embargo entiendo que el mantengo es vicioso y como una adiccion que muchos no pueden rechazar. La sociedad, por esa razon, tiene que imponer limitacciones a esa ayuda. Le doy las gracias al senor por darme la sabiduria de busar caminos productivos.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by MimaPr View Post
              Sonanbulo los boricuas estan en sus apartamentos, cogiendo welfare, cupones , plan 8, SSI y hasta la madre de los tomates......jejejejejeje Salen de Puerto Rico y en vez de progresar, prefieren el mantengo.



              Puerto Ricans at NASA

              This is a list of notable Puerto Rican scientists involved in the United States Space Program, also known as the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) and their contributions to said program. This list is not limited to Puerto Ricans born in Puerto Rico, it also includes people of Puerto Rican descent born elsewhere. According to an article written by Margarita Santori Lopez for the official newspaper of the University of Puerto Rico's Mayaguez Campus, "Prensa RUM", as of 2003, of the 114 Hispanics working at NASA Goddard Space Flight Center in Maryland, 70 were Puerto Ricans or of Puerto Rican descent. [1]

              User:Marine 69-71/Puerto Ricans in NASA - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



              List of Puerto Rican scientists and inventors
              List of Puerto Rican scientists and inventors - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

              Excerpt:

              PUERTO RICAN Income in USA:
              In 2002, the average individual income for Stateside Puerto Ricans was $33,927.[citation needed]This represented only 68.7 percent of the income of Whites ($48,687) and was below the average incomes of Asians ($49,981), Cubans ($38,733) and Mexicans ($38,200).[citation needed] However, it was higher than that of Dominicans ($28,467), and Central and South Americans ($30,444).[citation needed] In 2002, there were an estimated 24,450 Stateside Puerto Ricans with individual incomes of $100,000 or more, compared to 4,059 a decade earlier.

              The Latino Market and Remittances to Puerto Rico. Combined, the aggregate income for Stateside Puerto Ricans in 2002 was $54.5 billion. This aggregate personal income of Stateside Puerto Ricans exceeds the total personal income for Puerto Rico, which was $42.6 billion in 2000.
              Stateside Puerto Ricans - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


              Puerto Rican 65th Infantry Regiment
              65th Infantry Regiment (United States) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

              Comment


              • #8
                Reality Check

                First of all Radrook, nobody quotes from Wikipedia these days if they want to have some credibility. Its banned from Colleges because Wikipedia's info. + sources are dubious and can be changed at will by any writer.

                Second: I know that its about time Puerto Ricans began dealing with our problems. However it's always nice to hear about some success stories, but looking at the larger picture we are still in deep sh*t. We're still the bottom of the barrel compared to other groups, even Blacks. Its been like that for decades!

                When we stop "tapando el cielo con la mano" believing that everything is just fine, we ignore harsh realities and say to ourselves, "we are progressing beautifully". We then get complacent and ignore everything that's happening..

                What is wrong with us?

                On the average Puerto Ricans are RECOSTAOS" with an attitude "¿Yo preocuparme? Que lo haga otro". This was possibly ingrained in our psyche by being colonials for over a 100 years. We expect the government to take care of us in more ways than one.

                "Recostao" takes many forms, like working for the govermnment in a do nothing job for 20 years to secure a pension+ SS, and other government goodies. In fact Puerto Ricans love government jobs where they act as distributers of welfare to the poor. MMMMMMMM I wonder if it makes them feel like Robin Hood?

                "Recostao" is joining the armed forces in order to secure a life time pension+health services and in the process, like many who have come and gone here, criticized other Puerto Ricans for being "Mal Agradecidos" and envious.

                "Recostao" is wanting statehood for Puerto Rico because you want to continue the gravy train, where 60% of the population lives off Uncle Sam. When Statehood is granted it'll be 85% if we add the INCOME TAX CREDITS!

                "Recostao" is aspiring to live forever in a low rent housing project, with shoot outs, constant crime, garbage in the hall ways, pee and defecations in the elevators and always putting your life in danger.

                "Recostao" is not having high aspirations but still thinking you live very well. Imagine, we can't even figure out that the schools we send our kids to are bad. Schools are so bad in the ghetto's that even Blacks are pulling their kids out and sending them to charter schools with higher standards and free from the Teacher's Unions.

                Nonetheless, when going back to Puerto Rico these same folks tell their family,

                "Oye Puruca , que bien vivimos en los estados unidos. Vete pa llá. No sé como tu vives aquí con tanto crimen y falta de respeto. Allá tenemos Medicaid, que nos paga los mejores hospitales gratis. Fíjate, el nene va a una escuela dónde los maestros solo son americanos, y es una escuela "Especial". Además nos mandan un chequecito de SSI mensualmente. Tampoco tenemos que hablar inglés, como les dicen esos malditos "Hijos de Puta independentistas", pues hasta en la bodega de los Dominicanos nos entienden y nos dan fiao
                ."
                Last edited by clip314; 20th August 2010, 15:00.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Do you have any evidence to disprove any of the specific quotes? If not then it's your personal opinion against the quotes which can be easily verified and proven accurate via other quotes from sources considered more trustworthy. So attacking the source is irrelevant to the veracity of the statements.

                  Furthermore, my response was to what I perceived as a bigot remark expected from a racist bigoted non Puerto Rican who can only see the negative and wants to propagate it. Such one-sided attacks have to be responded to with counter examples. You don't think so? Good and well. Accept the bigoted remarks and smile. But don't try to force others to adopt the grin-and-take the abuse attitude that you seem to feel so comfy with. Others might not.

                  BTW

                  I know that more progress needs to be made and that there are serious flaws in the Puerto Rican character which tend to prevent progress. I could write a long list. But I disagree that a barrage of insults is the way to bring about change. In fact, if indeed people feel comfortable in given situation then change might not even be possible. There were nations during the Roman Empire days which felt pride on being Roman provinces. So this pride Puerto Ricans feel in being part of the USA isn't anything new in human history. I personally don't identify with the present Puerto Rican mentality. But I do recognize that it is their decision and that decision seems to be a very determined and firmly established one and that expecting things to suddenly change in the Puerto Rican mind is unrealistic.

                  As for SSI, as USA citizens they are as entitled as anyone else to that benefit. So I don't see the relevance to the subject in criticizing those who are availing themselves of their right to that service either due to illness being disabled, or age..
                  Last edited by Radrook; 22nd August 2010, 08:31.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Very good post Radrook........its good to know that not everybody in our race are negative and racist bigoted to our own like some here.

                    Some people paint all Puerto Rians with the same brush. That's why I said some people here have inferiority complex issues.


                    Let me answer some of the false myths somebody wrote here:


                    "Recostao" is joining the armed forces in order to secure a life time pension+health services and in the process, like many who have come and gone here, criticized other Puerto Ricans for being "Mal Agradecidos" and envious.



                    Spoken like a clueless fool that has never served in the Armed Forces. You work hard in the Armed Forces and nothing is given to you, the pay is not great as the civilian counterpart but you learn other things that you won't learn in the community college and there are other benefits.

                    There are evaluations on your job, performance and personal character all the time to be consider for advancement to the next pay grade and to re-enlist. If you don't make the grade you wont get promoted and if you dont get promoted in a window of time you can't re-enlist....if you make it to 20 yrs. in the Armed Forces, which is hard, then you have earned the benefits of their retirement.........I dont know where you get the "RECOSTAO" from......obviously you haven't served and dont know anything about the ARMED FORCES to say a irresponsible statement like that.




                    "Recostao" is wanting statehood for Puerto Rico because you want to continue the gravy train, where 60% of the population lives off Uncle Sam. When Statehood is granted it'll be 85% if we add the INCOME TAX CREDITS!


                    Puerto Rico doesn't need to be a state for some to continue the gravy train, they can get that by moving anytime to any of the 50 states or stay in the territory of Puerto Rico.

                    Its your opinion that under statehood Puerto Rico's economy will get worse.....no facts and no data to back that up.....37 territories became states and all of their economies improved.

                    Naive is to keep thinking that under a territory things will be better than a state.....if that's the case then there would be more territories with the ELA than states in the United States.

                    By the way, to get the INCOME TAX CREDIT under the federal laws.....you need to WORK!!!....thats the incentive for low and middle class working families...if they work and dont make enough then they get those tax credits......nothing wrong with that because thats the same thing for everybody for the rest of the 50 states.





                    I wont answer the rest because its obvious this guy is just too negative against his own race........reading him you come to the conclusion that we are worthless as a race.............I have been reading this cat for almost a year and I seriously think he has issues....he doesn't write one thing positive about our race and culture, everything is negative and he repeats the bigot remarks by non-Puerto Ricans and smiles because deep down he agrees with it.

                    Forget the millions of Puerto Rico that worked hard and made something out of their lives in the States or in the island,....nah!!! lets focus better on the negative and like a broken record go over and over and over again with the insults and stereotypes and then expect positive change.
                    Last edited by MikeRavens; 28th August 2010, 15:17.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      First of all Radrook, what ever I said in the post above are anecdotes, which are meant to be amusing, sometimes provoking discussions. However they may also capture the mood of a colonial society that's breaking down at the seams. We can intellectualize , ad anuseum, trying to understand and forgive our disfunctinal behaviors, but as you know they 'll get us nowhere.

                      To continue finding the good and ignoring our disfunction is to perpetuate it and encase it in folkloric discussions.

                      As I see it, we are mired in a colonial stupor which gives Puerto Rico a generalized feeling of falling apart. Check out Tipo's acecdotal posting in another part of this forum.

                      Its easy to say, " Clip, that's your opinion", but is there another? I haven't read many others that are much different.
                      The difference may be in the style of presentation, but the essence is basically the same. Our colonial society is falling apart and the only answer we have is Statehood, like if Gringos will save the day. Nonetheless, not many societies are willing to take on another to save them from their incompetency. People have to learn to take care of themselves.

                      On another note, Its awfully strange and inconsistent how most Puerto Ricans who receive "ayuditas" (military pensions, SSI, welfare etc.) are also strict defenders of the welfare empire. Ironically, they're also staunch conservatives and sympathizers with the Tea Party and the Republican Party.

                      However the Tea Party, which is growing by leaps and bounds, as noted by Glenn Beck's rally yesterday in Washington, 500,000 strong! is about restoring GOD and cutting ENTITLEMENTS. Remember ENTITLEMENTS are by which roughly 80% of Puerto Ricans live off.

                      But looking at this another way, it might also be a good thing. Why? Cutting off ENTITLEMENTS will begin to take the steam out of those Tipo, and THE ECONOMIST, found in Puerto Rico, "Los Bichotones". Those who live off their Mamis recieving SSI and food stamps. LOL

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        1) I didn't know military pensions and SSI were "ayuditas" (freebies) why do you put that in the same category as welfare Clippie? ........dont you have to earn that?...................dont you have a retirement plan Clippie at your job with a 401k or something similar? ....is that Welfare too?



                        2) Who are the "GRINGOS" ...do they have a name? The United States has 310 million residents without counting the 20 million+ of illegals. All of different colors, races and background............who is saying the "GRINGO" is going to save the Puerto Ricans?


                        3) Statehood is a systerm just like you are living now. Its not the end of the world......its not going to fix all of your personal problems but neither any other political status. I will tell you this much, statehood is better than a territory under the American System and under U.S. Citzenship.


                        4) There you go again with the Tea Party and Glenn Beck obsession......who cares? In the U.S. everybody has a right to gather/organize and protest and we all have freedom of speech. I dont see anything wrong in Beck or the Tea Party or any party or any group protesting and saying their opinions even if you dont agree with them................why are you so worry about that?


                        5) Whats wrong in talking about GOD? thats your right if you want to in this country...............I guess you want people with your opinion and that think like you to have freedomn of speech......the rest we just have to keep our mouths shut.




                        6) and by the way Clippie, you are clueless......what Beck is fighting against is the government spending, waste and fraud especially in this entitlements and putting God back in our schools...........thats his olpinion just like many...you can disagree or agree. ....you dont have to be a Tea Party or a Republican to agree with those basics things.

                        7) Not all Puerto Ricans are parasites and sucking on the welfare roles and committing fraud and lazy.....you are painting all Puerto Ricans with the same brush......which is sad in your case.

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